Customs for initiation names - Receiving a Vaishnava-name

The following is copied from another bulletin board, written by Jagat. I snipped out the part on Gaudiya Math standards, as I believe it is not of much concern to us. I thought the rest might be of interest here.

In the traditional Vaishnava world, one also receives a name at initiation. However, it is my impression that these names are little used by householders.

If someone is considered qualified, he may also receive a "manjari" name, which is one's spiritual identity in Radha and Krishna's pastimes and to which one aspires. This name is kept very secret, and is only revealed when one takes disciples oneself and gives siddha pranali.

When one takes vesh, one usually gets another name. This is most often a simple name of Krishna joined with Das. Renounced Vaishnavas generally just add the title "Babaji" and others call them "Maharaj" out of respect. So there are large numbers of "Krishna Das Babajis" or "Hari Das Babajis." Quite anonymous, actually. Certain exceptional Babajis are accepted in the community as "siddha" or perfected. The rule of thumb is that if someone manifests some kind of miraculous proof of having entered the nitya lila, he is called siddha. There are not many of these, and some Vaishnavas only accept four such Siddhas from the 19th century, and three of them were named Krishna Das.

The above comments about educational degrees applies here also. The general term used, though, is "Pandit." So you might get a "Ramakrishna Pandit Baba" or "Ananta Das Pandit."

I am under the impression that sometimes the name is only given at the time of bhekh, and no name is given prior to this, and that this is particularly the practice in some Gosvami lineages. For instance, I do not recall ever hearing Bhaktivinoda receive a name ending "Das".

Any further insights on this? Is there anything in this regard in the Hari Bhakti Vilasa?

I am curious about the practice of giving Sanksrit names that begin with the same letter as one's birth name. This would make sense from the standpoint of names that are given according to Hindu astrology, which specifies the available options for letters to use based on one's rashi chakra (birth chart). It does not really make much sense for those with English or European birth names, however, except as a matter of practicality - it would require getting an astrologer to cast charts for all disciples to figure out what the diksha name should start with.

Although Indian gurus have not adhered to this rule 100% (Vishnujana Swami had the birth name Mark D'Atillo and Bhaktivedanta gave Jan Brzezinski, Ph.D., who we know here as Jagat, the name Hiranyagarbha Dasa), it is generally applied most of the time.

QUOTE(Madhava @ Nov. 05 2002,17:57)

Actually, I think that you are right, Madhavaji. But you got a name. It is probably because in India, people nearly all have names that are already somehow related to Krishna or a god-like servant.

As far as references are concerned, we know that according to Pancharatra tradition, receiving a name is part of the five samskaras that are part of initiation. That verse is not quoted, I don't think, in HBV. In section 198 of Bhakti-sandarbha, the verse tApaH puNDraM tathA nAma [PadmaP 6.226.6] is cited (quoted fully in section 200).

And this:

täpädi-païca-saàskäro
navejyä-karma-kärakaù |
artha-païcaka-vid vipro
mahä-bhägavataù småtaù || [PadmaP 6.253.27]

"A Maha Bhagavata is a vipra who has received the five samskaras, who has engaged in the nine sacrifices, and who knows the five meanings." These are then described in the following text.

Sign of madhyama Vaishnava:

täpaà puëòraà tathä näma
mantro yägaç ca païcamaù |
amé païcaiva saàskäräù
paramaikänti-hetavaù ||

QUOTE

But you got a name.

He didn't actually give a name during the initiation ceremony. After the ceremony he called us upstairs into his office, and he spoke a couple of words along with giving us sheets with maha-mantra and the rest, but didn't say anything about names, and the meeting was about to conclude. Finally I asked if he will also give us new spiritual names. He then agreed, told us to write our Christian names down on a piece of paper, and return to him later on during the day. I do not know of any of his Western disciples who would not have received a spiritual name, though.

There's a funny story related with our returning to him later on about the names. After he'd given the names and after we honored some maha-prasad at his ashram, I asked, "What is the special meaning of the name Madhavananda"? I must have said it fast or put together a sentence with a complicated stucture, as apparently he understood something completely else and began replying, "Oh, a special name, a manjari-name, that you will get next time when you come." Although it was not exactly the reply I expected, I had no objection.

A tip for all of those who will in the future communicate with someone who doesn't speak fluent English, it is a good idea to speak clearly and to not form too complicated sentences, as otherwise the answer may be something very different from what you expected in response to your question.

QUOTE

As far as references are concerned, we know that according to Pancharatra tradition, receiving a name is part of the five samskaras that are part of initiation.

Receiving the name -- the verse does not explicitly say that the guru gives a name ending "Das". For all we can say from that verse, it may equally well mean that guru gives the thirty-two syllable Harinama to the initiate.

In his discourse on Panca-samskara (Sajjana Tosani, vol. 2/1, 1885, translated by Shukavak Das), Bhaktivinoda describes the item "nAma" as follows:

"Nama or name is the third samskara. Mercifully the teacher utters the name of Hari into the ear of the faithful student. This name is to be recited daily by the student.

[Receiving name means that one understands one's self to be a servant of Hari. During initiation the teacher also gives a personal a name to the student which indicates devotion to Hari. In the Sri Sampradaya of Ramanuja, names like Rama Krishna Dasa, Narayana Dasa, Ramanuja Dasa etc. are given. In the Gaudiya Sampradaya names such as Sri Govinda Dasa, Sri Nityananda Dasa, Sri Caitanya Dasa etc. are used. Since the time of Srimad Mahaprabhu names like Ratnabahu, Kavikaranapura, Premanidhi etc. have been used. Subsequently even names such as Bhagavatabhusana, Gitabhusana, Bhaktibhusana etc. are employed.]"

The first paragraph very clearly indicates that the "nAma" refers to tarak-brahma-nama which the initiate is to chant on a daily basis. Nobody will take a vow to chant his own name on a daily basis.

The second paragraph in brackets elaborates on the meaning of nAma in the context of giving a particular name to the initiate, but I suspect this is not written by Bhaktivinoda, but rather added in by Shukavak.

[quote]
He didn't actually give a name during the initiation ceremony. After the ceremony he called us upstairs into his office, and he spoke a couple of words along with giving us sheets with maha-mantra and the rest, but didn't say anything about names, and the meeting was about to conclude.

I don't know what is experience for example of Radhapada,but i have received harinama in a same way like Madhava.Only difference is that on my first initiation ceremony i have received also diksa mantras.My wife,son and myself have received then names like about two hours later.It just depends on situation,time,place and circumstances.

Finally I asked if he will also give us new spiritual names. He then agreed, told us to write our Christian names down on a piece of paper, and return to him later on during the day. I do not know of any of his Western disciples who would not have received a spiritual name, though.

It is how everybody receives it.Even when i was initiated in Gaudiya Math,i did receive harinam in a solitary initiation in India.Of course ritual is different.GM ritual during harinama initiation(and in some cases during diksa)is not elaborate or done in a original way like in traditional gaudiya line.

There's a funny story related with our returning to him later on about the names. After he'd given the names and after we honored some maha-prasad at his ashram, I asked, "What is the special meaning of the name Madhavananda"? I must have said it fast or put together a sentence with a complicated stucture, as apparently he understood something completely else and began replying, "Oh, a special name, a manjari-name, that you will get next time when you come." Although it was not exactly the reply I expected, I had no objection.

When people from other countries come and speak with Baba it is best like you said to speak slow and clear and that Baba can understand.

A tip for all of those who will in the future communicate with someone who doesn't speak fluent English, it is a good idea to speak clearly and to not form too complicated sentences, as otherwise the answer may be something very different from what you expected in response to your question.

I know one thing also(with many of his other innumerable and countless qualities)that Baba can understand persons( or disciples) heart and he always loves and understands his disciples.Therefore i have realized there on the spot how important is to be in association with ones Guru.When i saw him first time it was electricity shortage(like everyday in Radhakunda)and my wife,son and me came to see Him as soon as we got at Radhakunda.In that total dark he was sitting in his chair, doing his bhajana ,and i have said: Dear Guru Maharaja,we are so happy that we came to see you.He replied:I was waiting for you,i am so happy that you finally came.
Nothing in the world can erase that and other moments with Baba from my mind.And that was just beginning.I was thinking that i will never cry for a Guru and that such a thing is just sentimental trap of mind.Whenever my wife and me saw Him first time we have cried ,and we were so happy, and that happiness just immediately takes place forever inside your heart and soul.I am not being sentimental or new agey,that is my realization (and i have many other ones about him).

Mostly for my initiations i have to thank and pay my fully prostrated dandavats to following great devotees or bhaktas,dadas and didis:
Radhapada das (who gave me gigantic impetus for my initiation and my spiritual life in general, and for his siksa)
Madhava (who really have explained to me many,many original traditionalist,orthodox gaudiya vaisnava goals,conclusions and explanations of sastras,for his friendship,and many advices)
Haricarana das,for his real humility, vaisnava behaviour and his many invaluable advices,
Advaita das and his good wife Anuradha (without his translations and advices i will not be able to know nothing),Sri Hari das from Croatia,disciple of Pran Krishna das Baba for opening my eyes,Karunamayi das and Karunamayi dasi,and their gurubhai Govinda das without whom i will never have chance to stay in Radhakunda during Nyama seva or Kartik and for their inumerable and nice advices.
Nitai das(who also first gave me impetus to take initiation long time ago when i first wrote to him,also for shocking truth and for opening fully my eyes ,and later of course for his advices)
Govindapada das,Madhusudana das,Jagannath das,Sakhi Priya didi,Navadvip das,Anupa das,Dina das,Yugal Kishor das,Sacinanadana das(my gurubhai)and Dina Hari das,my old good friend from Germany who just with one letter to me, have changed my life.Except three devotees on this list all of the above mentioned are my gurubrothers and gurusisters,and all of those people above i consider very helpful for me and advanced in their bhajana.Without their great help my wife,my son and me will never get mercy of Baba and devotees.Also not to forget Braj Mohan das and Govinda das,disciples of Pran Krishna das Baba which were always there like good friends.
May Sri Sri Radha and Krishna bless you all,forever in your bhajana.

My sincere thanks to all of you,

QUOTE

When people from other countries come and speak with Baba it is best like you said to speak slow and clear and that Baba can understand.

A tip for all of those who will in the future communicate with someone who doesn't speak fluent English, it is a good idea to speak clearly and to not form too complicated sentences, as otherwise the answer may be something very different from what you expected in response to your question.

I know one thing also(with many of his other innumerable and countless qualities)that Baba can understand persons( or disciples) heart, and he always loves and understands his disciples.

Yes, there's much more to the relationship between guru and disciple, than just the words that are spoken. One time we went to see Baba with my husband (Madhavananda das) and he asked some questions from Baba. Madhava asked one question about Radhakunda, and Baba then spoke about the subject matter, but didn't really answer the question itself. But as soon as we made our obeisances to Baba and began to leave the room, the answer was suddenly revealed in Madhava's heart. We could only smile and wonder. Maybe Madhava can himself share more about this, since it was his realization.