Migrating to India - Economy and related issues - Projections for the future

The issue of migrating to India in the foreseeable future is, I believe, a concept many of us have to deal with. However, so as to not make a disaster out of it in all of our enthusiasm for living in Vraja, a good many issues need to be considered - mainly in the realm of economy.

The prospect of earning a substantial fund here in the West and depositing it on a high-interest account, and primarily living off the interests while leading a peaceful life of bhajan, is undoubtedly appealing. Currently, one can get up to 6% yearly interest on high interest savings accounts and 8% on government obligations in India. A deposit of $40.000 split 25%/75% between the two would then yield $3000 yearly, or $250 monthly - at the current rate 10.800 INR - is a luxurious amount, considering that monthly rent and food together come to around 3000 INR.

India, however, is developing and growing at a substantial rate on all fronteers. The population is projected to grow from 1.1bn to 1.6bn by 2050, leaving China behind with a mere 1.4bn. More and more Western capital flows in with outsourced work, the country is increasingly integrating with the West, a wannabe super power in growing.

What is the impact of all this on the day-to-day economy, in particular in the rural areas that are our main concern? (Assuming Vraja will remain a rural area!) What kinds of developments are we looking at in the foreseeable future? What do we need to prepare for? It certainly wouldn't be realistic to assume that the situation of the day would last for our lifetimes, and we wouldn't like to drop in a hole after ten peaceful years, as finances go haywire and everything starts falling apart.

Let's pool together resources and information on this important topic, shall we?

Fantastic topic ! Very Interesting indeed. go ahead with all possible scenarios we may need to deal with.....
Also consider the possibility of decrease in interest rate in future.

Jay Nitai

Also, one must consider the inflationary pressures on the initial investment. out of your 6% interest, half or more can be eaten up by the inflation. While not a major point, it needs to be considered.

Exactly: All of that needs to be considered. The possible influence of inflation, the avenues for dividing your investment in a relatively risk-free manner. Let's have it all mapped in this thread.

and for a small fee I can supply my anti-parasitic herbal formula needed for life in these parts

but seriously - medical emergencies and costs are a part of life and any good long term financial plan. 20% of annual cost of life is considered standard, rising up to 40% as we age.

You can get medical insurane for you and your family by spending 7000 INR annually.

I think the current exchange rate is around 46 INR = 1 USD. So $250/month would come out to about 10,000 INR/ month after exchange costs. Such ratios often change dramaticaly with time, as evident in the history of exchange rates in Eastern Europe. Still, one needs to start somewhere for such calculations.

I think catering to a devotee expatriate community could be made into good business for someone in India. Someone honest I hope...

There's a very informative website dealing with these issues www.simpleliving.net
It's based on a great book by Joe Dominguez: Your Money or Your Life; Transforming your relationship with money and achieving financial independence.

The key is to invest in longterm (government, or municiple etc.) bonds yielding a decent inteest. You can live off the interest, get your principle back in 25 or 30 years for reinvestment, and if interest rates drop your bonds will increase in market value.

It seems that it should come natural for devotees to live a frugal, healthier lifestyle than most, and the book explains that inflation should be no big deal.

Radhe!
in addition, may I suggest a mutual fund? The us stock market over any ten year period has never under-performed a 10% profit margin. When nicely diversified, a mutual fund with aggressive growth when young can yeild a substantial amount for old age.
My wife and I have mutual funds and even in bad stock market times they have performed very well.

When I was in Sri Lanka lately, I spoke with a lot of relatives who plan to move to India. One of them informed me of a new scheme initiated by the State Bank of India that offers a 9% interest rate. It's something that I'll be checking out since I'm interested in buying up some properties over there.

I suggest that properties is a good investment. Buying up several properties and rentng them out and living off that rent seems to be a sound idea, excluding the problems that may naturally arise of course.

I am very interested in the topic of this thread. I have also been pondering this issue for some time. Bringing funds there and living from interest would be wonderful, however for those going there with relatively small funds expecting to live off of accrued interest will likely meet with financial hardship.
I am curious about inventive ways to earn income while in India. Would there not be a way for example, to sell Indian merchandise online without getting wrapped up in some huge ordeal?

Legal issues are a huge issue, IMO. Unless or until India starts granting more Westerners residency, it'll always be a bit risky to try and make a living there. Considering that there are 1 billion other souls there trying to do the same and the history of exploitative Westerners, it is understandable. On a recent visit, a longterm resident, experienced in a variety of Indian law, advised me not to even make largish book purchases while visiting on a tourist visa. You only need one person with an ax to grind and you could find yourself in some strife.

That said, an honest sadhaka with a respectful attitude can often get a favorable hearing from the authorities but it is a shame that it's such a difficult country with which to establish a legal relationship with. I think you need to make money in the west, make use of long term tourist visas, and hope that the laws change. I read an article in the NY Times last week on graduates from American universities taking internship positions with India tech companies. This pull towards globalization will hopefully reduce the barriers that we face now.

Really serious sadhakas need to marry Indian citizens.

The only business I would imagine you can safely do on a tourist visa is delivering immaterial goods -- services, such as web design -- over the internet to outside India. Doing it inside India means having a reputation ("that Western dude offering good services"). Purchasing goods and sending them abroad definitely means gaining a reputation. You might get away with fixing deals for some Western people on silver or other such stuff and getting the commission directly off them. Small retail business will in all likelihood get you eventually busted if you're on a tourist visa, and you do that month in and month out. The FRO (Foreign Registration Office) are keeping tabs on people pretty tight.

Or otherwise, you can just get a business visa and do business officially. I think they only give those for a year at a time, though they're probably more easily extendable than tourist visas. Anyone have experience with that?

http://www.indianembassy.org/consular/visa_guide.htm

Pretty much like a tourist visa in terms of duration, renewability, etc. What they don't mention is what you'd need to do with regard to taxes and all. Setting up a "joint venture" is one thing--implies local ownership to some extent, owning your own business or generating an income is another. Even a few years ago as tourists you were meant to get tax clearance before leaving the country. You had to declare how much you spent and earned during your stay. It wasn't enforced but many people got stung at the airport if the customs' officers decided they didn't like you or wanted a little kickback.

Ten year multiple entry? Sounds pretty good. I wonder how that works with non-profits who have branches in India, and who have paid employees?

10 year multi-entry is what is avialable in the US for tourists also; 5 year multi-entry for Commonwealth citizens.

The non-profit angle would be an interesting one to investigate.

Vraja has become quite the fashion for middle and upper-class Delhi residents within the last 10 years especially thus driving inflation. Most holy places in India already have an inflated economy, Vraja being one of the most quickly increasing, especially due to so many westerners dropping tons of money into real estate through 2nd parties.

Yet at heart Vraja is still rural, but probably not for long. As with any other developing nation everything is possible with money.

It's in who you know, and how much money you have. Most incorperated organizations can pull strings for 5 year single-entry visas and the like. But yes, to do business in India and get citizenship is a maze of payoffs and ripoffs, as I've known several people attempting each. I'm not trying to be negative, that's just how it is, and it is understandable to some extent. Perhaps if possible going through a legitimate company that is actually trying to do business with the west is the best way these days.

The 5 & 10 year US tourist visas require leaving the country every six months.

Once when I had a tourist visa, my wife and I crossed to Nepal paying the border officers $25 then crossed back into India after lunch and got our visas re-stamped on the Indian side. One must be creative ...

As far as fixed deposit goes, India is in more or less in a bull market in (belated) competition with China for foreign investment and GDP growth, and has opened many govt. controlled industries to public investment in the last 10 years, to the good merit of Rao's efforts in the '90's. The present PM, Manmohan Singh, is an economist, and was not appointed PM by accident . In short it's probably the safest time to invest money in India the last 100 years.

Actually this is not quite true. One can extend a Tourist Visa up to a year, but one has to register with the local FRO within the first two weeks of entry. I have personally done this.

All in all, until retirement I think that one would be best to visit India once a year in the Winter months. Then spend the rest of the year in the West making a living. This is the best way to ensure one has enough money to retire in India (or where ever). Then if one wants to retire in India I would suggest that you find a doctor who will sign off on giving you an ongoing treatment for some sort of disease. Thus taking advantage of the new medical visas, which are totally extendable. Of course I don't know whether the government will catch on to this idea or not, but it seems like a natural thing for older devotees to do.

"Doc, my skin has turned white."

"Ah, videshi bhakta syndrome. The treatment will take a long time."

"Doc, my heart palpitates with sensual desires."

"Open wide and say, Radhaaaaaaaa! Yes, bhava-roga. We'll begin treatment immediately."

Gauranga Nidani Amar
Bidhan Koila
Harinam MahaouShad
Bidhan Koila


My Doctor Gauranga
prescribed me
Harinama Maha medicine
prescribed me

I suspect this is more of a regional variation in policy , and should not be relyed upon.