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Discussions on the doctrines of Gaudiya Vaishnavism. Please place practical questions under the Miscellaneous forum and set this aside for the more theoretical side of it.

Prema - Madhurya Kadambini



Jagat - Tue, 19 Oct 2004 21:17:46 +0530
Section 8.4

The conflicting emotions of Prema

I am looking at this passage and it seems to me that no one has translated it correctly. The word "Ananda" at the end is the source of the trouble. The passage is very properly structured. (A) With the experience of Krishn's qualities, AND (B) with the increased eagerness and anxiety to experience even more, there is (C ) an ocean of ecstasy. In other words, equal weight is given to the two experiences, and there is no explicit causal relation given here. (The causal relationship is mutual.)

This contrast or conflict will be elaborated on in great detail in the subsequent sections of MK, but here Vishwanath is in the process of explaining this contrast. All the translators (including Ananta Dasji, who mostly follows Priya Charan Dasji's edition) have followed the structure in this way: (B) Withe the increased eagerness, one (A) experiences Krishna's qualities, (C ) and so experiences an ocean of ecstasy. This seems right, but does not follow the structure of the Sanskrit.

Anyway, I am trying this out and we'll see how it looks. It may make more sense to go back to the way everyone else has done it. I have formatted the Sanskrit and punctuated it according to the "ca"s.

tataz ca premaiva cumbakI-bhAvam Apadya kArSNAyasIbhUtaM kRSNam AkRSyAnIya kasmiMzcana kSaNe bhaktasyAsya nayana-gocarIkaroti | tatra ca saundarya-saurabhya-sausvarya-saukumArya-saurasyaudArya-kAruNyAnIti svIyAH svarUpa-bhUtAH parama-kalyANa-guNAH bhagavatA sva-bhaktasya tasya nayanAdiSv indriyeSu nidhIyante |

(A1) teSAM ca parama-madhuratve nitya-navatve ca
(SUBJECT1) bhaktasyAsya ca tad-AsvAdayituH premNaiva pravartamAne
(B1)
pratikSaNa-vardhiSNau mahotkaNThAyAM ca
(C1)
ko’py Ananda-mahodadhir

Avirbhavan nArhati kavi-sarasvatI-lakuTyA parimeyatAm | yathA hi—

(A2) atiniviDatara-viTapa-dala-kula-pravalita-mahA-nyagrodha-talasya sura-dIrghikA-hima-salila-sambhRta-ghaTa-zata-valayita-taTasyAtiziziratve
(SUBJECT2)
tad-Azrayitur janasya ca,
(B2) tapartu-taraNi-kiraNa-tapta-maru-saraNi-mahA-pAnthatve ca,

(A3) tathA kAdambinI-ghanAsArasyApAratva iva
(SUBJECT3) tad-abhiSicyamAnasya vana-mataGgajasya
(B3) cirantana-dava-davathu-dUnatve ca,

(A4) tathA sudhA-kiraNasyAtimadhuratve
(B4)
svAda-lolupatve ca,

(C2-4) yas tAdAtmika AnandaH,

sa eva dig-darzanArthaM tasyopamAnIkriyate.

(1) Sarvabhavana : At a later stage prema assumes the character of a strong magnet drawing to itself even Lord Krishna, the attractive iron, and one day prema arranges for the pure devotee a direct audience with the Lord. And the Supreme Lord reciprocates by revealing to the pure devotee his intimate, divine and auspicious attributes such as his ravishing beauty, physical fragrance, melodious voice, ever fresh youthfulness (?), versatile love (?), magnanimity and compassion, which the pure devotees directly perceive with their senses. As these attributes are nectarean and dynamic, prema produces in the devotee's heart an ever increasing, powerful desire to fully relish the Lord's transcendental qualities. The devotee finds himself swimming in an unlimited ocean of bliss that no words can adequately describe.

The exultation of a devotee experiencing pream is likened to a traveler who, after painfully traversing the burning desert sand in the middle of summer, finds an oasis cooled by a fresh stream gurgling under the shade of a huge banyan tree. The bliss of prema is further likened to the happiness a wild elephant feels after being trapped in a smouldering forest fire and then suddenly drenched in torrential rains; or like a gourmet, who after many days of sickness and being fed medicines and a bland frugal diet becomes well and is given a feast.

Of course these descriptions merely offer an idea of the devotee's state of joy because it cannot be compared to any material happiness. Material happiness and spiritual happiness are totally different from each other by nature--material happiness is a product of Maya shakti, or the illusory potency, whereas the devotee's bilss directly comes from the Lord's internal potency or svarupa shakti.

(2) Dinabandhu: Then one day, in this state, the magnet of prema attracts the black iron like Krishna making him appear before the eyes of the devotee. The Lord then floods his devotee's senses with the unrivaled auspicioius qualities springing from his own eternal being: beauty, fragrance, pleasant voice, tenderness, tastiness, generosity and compassion. The uncommon sweetness and ever-freshness of these qualities create an acute ever-increasing longing in the heart as the devotee relishes them. To describe the vast ocean of transcendental bliss appearing at this time the words of the poet are no better than a tiny lota (?).

Some meager examples can be given. A traveler on a desert path scorched by the hot rays of the summer sun somehow finds shelter under the cool shade of a vast banyan tree densely tangled with branches and surrounded by hundreds of vessels of ice-cold Ganga water. An elephant caught in a forest fire for a long time is finally bathed by unlimited streams of water from a thick bank of rainclouds. A person plagued by hundreds of mortal diseases and burning with thirst by chance drinks exquisitely sweet nectar. The incredible happiness that each of these three feels gives only a tiny glimpse of the unbounded bliss felt by the devotee in prema.

(3) Advaita Dasji After that, this prema assumes the nature of a magnet that attracts the black iron-like Sri Krishna , making Him appear before the devotee at some time. The Lord then also shows His own most auspicious innate attributes like beauty, nice fragrance, nice voice, His tenderness, nice taste, generosity and compassion to the senses, like the eyes, of His devotee. All these attributes are most sweet and eternally fresh and when the devotee starts to relish them with love, it increases within his heart at every moment. This causes a powerful eagerness and finally creates an ocean of ecstasy that no poet could properly describe. The bliss that a devotee enjoys at that time can only be slightly compared to the bliss a traveller on a sunstricken desert road feels when he comes to the cooling shade of the dense foliage provided by a thick Banyan-tree and takes shelter of a shore washed by hundreds of jugs of cold celestial Ganges water, or a forest elephant, who is constantly tormented by a forest fire feels when he is showered by an unending stream of water, or a person who is afflicted by hundreds of ailments and who is very greedy for taste feels when he suddenly gets sweet nectar to drink.

(4) Jagat: At this point, prema takes on the characteristics of a magnet and attracts Krishna like an iron filing, bringing him right to the devotee and making him visible. Then the Lord himself makes his own most auspicious innate attributes--his stunning beauty, divine fragrance, melodious voice, delicate skin, delectable taste, his magnanimity and loving compassion--perceptible to the devotee’s eyes and other senses. All these attributes are most sweet and eternally fresh and, as the devotee’s love for Krishna grows within him, his anxiousness to to relish them increases with every moment. The ocean of ecstasy that results from this is beyond the power of any poet to describe. And yet one tries, and so the following comparisons are made: It is like the ecstasy of one taking shelter of the cooling shade under the dense foliage provided by a banyan tree on ground that has been washed by hundreds of jugs of refreshing celestial Ganges water constrasted with the road through the desert that is baked by the rays of the summer sun. It is also like the ecstasy of the forest elephant that is drenched by a monsoon cloudburst constrasted with the tormented of being trapped in a forest conflagration. It is like the divine sweetness of ambrosia constrasted with the anxious greed for tasting it.

(Everyone has really improvised on tathA sudhA-kiraNasyAtimadhuratve svAda-lolupatve ca. It is not exactly parallel to the two previous examples, though everyone has forced their own parallellism on it. Anyway, I might change it back to something closer--I already have by adding "contrasted with"
Jagat - Thu, 21 Oct 2004 03:09:40 +0530
MK 8.6

punaz ca tenApi tathA tathaiva caturtha-mahA-mUrcchArambhe paJcamaM svAdhara-sambandhi saurasyaM tadIya-rasanendriya-grAhyaM preyasI-bhAvavaty eva tat-kAla-prAdurbhUta-tad-abhISTAkAra-rati-bhajana eva prakAzyate, nAnyatra.

This passage is interesting in part because there is an alternative reading. Instead of "abhISTAkAra-rati-bhajane", Hakim's edition has "abhISTAkAravati jane."

SB: Just as before, when the devotee swoons in indescribably joy, the Lord shows his fifth opulence, that of versatile loving exchanges (?!). Krishna offers the devotee sublime ambrosia in the form of chewed remnants from his mouth and lips. As the bhakta fully relishes it, his sense of taste becomes satiated. At this stage, the Lord appears to his devotee who is now absorbed in the conjugal mellow, and initiates him into a transcendental loving exchange of intense loving intimacy., long coveted by him. Of course, the Lord never divulges such a confidential mood to any other devotee except one who is in the conjugal mellow.

DB: At the start of the fourth swoon, the Lord restores him by giving his fifth madhurya, the taste of the nectar of his lips (saurasya). But this he reveals only to those who at this time are in the mood of conjugal love and desire this, but not to others.

AD: Again, at the beginning of the fourth great swoon, the Lord shows his fifth sweetness; the taste of the nectar of his lips becomes perceivable to the devotee’s tongue. But this he reveals only to those who are in an amorous relation with him, not to any other devotee.

Translating literally, I get this

punaz ca (again, furthermore) tenApi (by him, Krishna) tathA tathaiva (in the same way as before) caturtha-mahA-mUrcchArambhe (as the fourth great swoon takes place) paJcamaM (the fifth divine attribute) svAdhara-sambandhi (related to the lips) saurasyaM (delectable taste) tadIya-rasanendriya-grAhyaM (perceptible to the devotee's tasting organ, the tongue) preyasI-bhAvavaty eva (only to one who has the mood of a beloved) tat-kAla-prAdurbhUta-tad-abhISTAkAra-rati-bhajana (who is engaged in worship according to a love that has taken the desired form manifested at that very moment) eva (only, certainly) OR tat-kAla-prAdurbhUta-tad-abhISTAkAravati jana (a devotee who at that very moment has been given his desired form) prakAzyate (is revealed), nAnyatra (nowhere else).

In either case, there is certainly something missing in all the above translations:

Jagat: Again, when the devotee is overwhelmend by the fourth great swoon, the Lord comes to his rescue by revealing his fifth divine attribute, the delectable taste of the nectar of his lips, which is perceptible to the devotee’s tongue. But this is only given to those who love him in the erotic mood and who have, //at that moment, been awarded a body suitable to that mood, not to any other devotee. (According to Hakim's reading) OR according to the Priya Charan Dasji/Ananta Dasji reading // "who at that moment are engaged in bhajan in the identity that has manifested at that time in the desired form."

The Hakim reading seems superior to me, because its relation to tat-preyasI-bhAvavati is clear. It is neither rati nor bhajan, that takes form at that time ("tat-kAla-prAdurbhUta"), but the form suitable for being kissed by Krishna.

Krishna has been awarding a vision of his beauty, his fragrance, his touch, etc. It was even described how he touched devotees in different moods (foot on the head for dasya, hand in hand for sakhya, hand wiping tears for vatsalya, and physical embrace to those in madhura rasa. All these took place where? In the sadhaka deha or the siddha deha? The assumption seems to be that they took place in the sadhaka deha, with a special note for this last sensual experience of Krishna.

Another question arises: Does one in manjari bhava get a kiss at this time? I think I would like one...
Satyabhama - Thu, 21 Oct 2004 06:20:59 +0530
QUOTE
Another question arises: Does one in manjari bhava get a kiss at this time? I think I would like one...


ohmy.gif laugh.gif biggrin.gif tongue.gif blush.gif wub.gif

I really *really* hope you get one! God bless you!
Jagat - Thu, 21 Oct 2004 22:34:42 +0530
QUOTE( kreeshna in PM)
mad.gif This is why I am angry at you. You ask if one in manjari bhava would like a kiss from Krishna. Even if they would, they wouldn't want one. They would serve Srimati Radharani instead. mad.gif


Actually, that was something of a difficult thing to admit. But if it's good enough for Vishwanath Chakravarti Thakur, it's good enough for me.
babu - Fri, 22 Oct 2004 01:36:26 +0530

QUOTE( kreeshna in PM)
mad.gif This is why I am angry at you. You ask if one in manjari bhava would like a kiss from Krishna. Even if they would, they wouldn't want one. They would serve Srimati Radharani instead. mad.gif


Could one sneak a kiss and not tell?
Jagat - Fri, 22 Oct 2004 01:58:53 +0530
MK 8.7. Another complex passage. The key is recognizing that the subject is "saptamam" which is described in a long clause ending with "vilasitam" (#2 below). Then it goes on to end with the verb (Sanskrit verbs often indicate the end of the sentence) "udayate" (end of #3)

(1) tataz ca,
saundaryAdInAM yAvanti mAdhuryANi
teSAM sAmastyenAnububhUSAv api
asmin bhakta-cAtaka-caJcu-paTe
jalada-bindv-AvalIva na mAnti,
tAni vimRzya “aho tarhi mayaitAni saundaryAdIny etAvanti kim-arthaM dhRtAni?” iti teSAM sambhojanAyaiva

(2) saptamaM
(a) sarva-zakti-kadamba-paramAdhyakSAyA
(b) AgamAdAv api vimalotkarSiNy-AdInAm aSTa-dig-daleSu vartamAnAnAM svarUpa-zaktInAM madhya eva karNikAyAM mahArAja-cakravartinyA iva sthitAyA hi,
© anugrahAbhidhAnatvena uktAyA
(d) bhagavato nayanAravinda eva AtmAnaM vyaJjayantyAH
(e) kRpA-zakter
vilasitaM

(3) kvacit dAsAdau vAtsalyam iti, kvacit kAruNyam iti,
priyAdau ceto-drava iti kvacid anu
kati-nAmnAbhidhIyamAnam udayate |

(4) yayaiva kRpA-zaktyA sarva-vyApiny api tadIyecchA-zaktiH
sAdhuSu sAdhv evaM raJjitA
paramAtmArAmAn api mahA-camatkRti-bhUmIr adhyArohayati |

(5) yayaiva bhagavato bhakta-vAtsalyaM nAma eka eva guNaH samrAD iva prathama-skandhe pRthivyoktAn svarUpa-bhUtAn satya-zaucAdIn kalyANa-guNAn zAsti ||7||


I won't bother giving all the other translations--The context is this: Krishna has revealed himself to the premi devotee's senses, one by one. Then his sixth attribute, audarya, made it possible for the devotee to experience all the Lord's attributes with all his senses simultaneously. Now the problem is the inability of the devotee to fully experience the Lord fully.

Even so, as the premi devotee eagerly tries to relish all of Krishna's sweet attributes in full, he feels himself unable to do so, any more than a chatak bird can catch all the drops of rain in his tiny beak. Seeing this, the Lord thinks, “Ah! Why do I have so much sweetness in me?” And so, just to allow his devotee to fully partake of it, he reveals his seventh divine attribute, his compassion (kAruNya). This attribute is the expansion of the supreme chief of all the Lord’s energies, his mercy (kRpA), who sits in the whorl of the lotus like a great queen surrounded by all his other energies who sit on the petals of that lotus, whose names like Vimala and Utkarshini have been revealed in the Agama scriptures and elsewhere. This power of mercy, also known as Anugraha, manifests herself first in Krishna’s eyes and then appears in the devotees where she is given different appellations, such as protective affection (vAtsalya) or kindness (kAruNya) to those who have moods like that of servitude, or as "the melting of the heart" (ceto-drava) to those in the mood of romantic love.

Through this kripa shakti, the Lord’s all-pervading will (icchA-zakti) takes on colors in the saintly devotee and elevates even those who are supremely self-satisfied to a state of supreme wonder. It is through this kripa shakti that the Lord’s virtue known as “bhakta-vatsalya,” his protective tenderness for his devotees, is established as the emperor ruling over all his other attributes, which were named by Bhumi Devi in the first canto of the Srimad Bhagavatam.


I have to like Sarvabhavana's translations. They are sometimes brilliant, sometimes completely off the wall. ("This opulence is the headmistress of all the other attributes." “Just as a swallow with its beak shut tight is unable to slake its thirst even when it rains”)

I am not quite sure where all translators get the citta-vidrAviNI AkarSaNa-zakti as a translation for ceto-dravaH. It seems to me that these manifestation of Krishna’s mercy are his attributes. So it is his heart that is melting; it is not a potency of the devotee. But I guess I’ll have to translate it that way, since that is what everyone else has done. The version that says the vAtsalya is the manifestation of the mothers is found in Hakim’s and Priyacharan Dasji’s translations and also in Sarvabhavana’s, but Ananta Dasji correctly rejected it (as the vAtsalya is Krishna’s bhakta-vAtsalya). Krishna’s mercy is fundamentally his love for his devotee.

But then how to explain citta-vidrAviNI AkarSaNa-zakti as a translation for ceto-dravaH? I guess the best way to accommodate that would be to say that the devotees in madhura rasa perceive Krishna’s mercy in his heart-melting attractiveness. So I guess that is how I’ll have to translate it.
Satyabhama - Fri, 22 Oct 2004 02:02:45 +0530
QUOTE
Could one sneak a kiss and not tell?


And who would tell? Not Govinda, that's for sure... smile.gif
Satyabhama - Fri, 22 Oct 2004 02:05:51 +0530
QUOTE
Even so, as the premi devotee eagerly tries to relish all of Krishna's sweet attributes in full, he feels himself unable to do so, any more than a chatak bird can catch all the drops of rain in his tiny beak. Seeing this, the Lord thinks, “Ah! Why do I have so much sweetness in me?” And so, just to allow his devotee to fully partake of it, he reveals his seventh divine attribute, his compassion (kAruNya). This attribute is the expansion of the supreme chief of all the Lord’s energies, his mercy (kRpA), who sits in the whorl of the lotus like a great queen surrounded by all his other energies who sit on the petals of that lotus, whose names like Vimala and Utkarshini have been revealed in the Agama scriptures and elsewhere. This power of mercy, also known as Anugraha, manifests herself first in Krishna’s eyes and then appears in the devotees where she is given different appellations, such as protective affection (vAtsalya) or kindness (kAruNya) to those who have moods like that of servitude, or as "the melting of the heart" (ceto-drava) to those in the mood of romantic love.


I am absolutely awestruck.

Jagat, have you read Swamy Vedanta Desika's "dayaa satakam"

Dayaa Devi is so overwhelming! smile.gif smile.gif smile.gif

Ok, if you like, here is the link Dayaa Satakam (scroll to the bottom of the page for the devanagari script)
Jagat - Fri, 22 Oct 2004 06:42:50 +0530
Thanks, Satya. I have never seen this before. I'll try to take a look at it when I get the time. I'll try to get more stuff on here, since you're enjoying it.
Satyabhama - Fri, 22 Oct 2004 19:15:35 +0530
Thank you Jagat. smile.gif
Jagat - Mon, 25 Oct 2004 21:55:08 +0530
Here are the translations of sections 8.8-8.11 of MK. This concludes the chapter on prema. There are two more sections, but these are a resume of the entire book.

8.8

The scriptures list eighteen flaws to which conditioned souls are subject: Delusion, drowsiness, mistakes, exploitation, intense lust, restlessness, intoxication, envy, violence, sorrow, fatigue, untruth, anger, hunger, doubt, universal folly, partiality and dependence on others. Yet, though the scriptures also proclaim that these faults do not exist in the Lord, they can sometimes be found in avatars like Rama and Krishna, where they appear in the service of his attribute of compassion. These flaws are then experienced as great virtues by his devotees.

The devotee who has gained the power and resilience to completely relish all these, as well as the beauty and other attributes extended by the Lord, savors them repeatedly, to the point that he reaches the supreme limit of wonder. There he directly experiences over and over again this unequalled affection the Lord has for his devotees, and this completely reduces his heart to liquid.

8.9

The Lord then says, “O best of devotees! For many births you have given up wife, children and material well-being for my sake. You have endured so many hardships like cold, wind, hunger, thirst, pain and disease, in order to serve me. You have disregarded so many insults and even taken up begging to eke out a living. I do not know how to repay you and so remain your debtor. To offer you lordship over the world, mastery of the heavens or mystic perfections would be an insult—how could anyone offer a human being animal fodder like straw or grain husks? Hence, though I am Ajita, the invincible, you have won me over. The vine of your good conduct is now my only support.”

Taking these most pleasing words and pinning them to his ears like earrings, the devotee replies, “O Lord! O Master! O ocean of compassion! You saw how I had fallen into the raging current of material existence where I was being being chewed to bits by swarms of crocodile-like sufferings. This made your butter-like heart melt, so even though you are beyond the mundane world, you assumed the form of Sri Guru. By cutting through my timeless ignorance with the Sudarshan disc of your darshan in that form, you released me from those crocodiles’ jaws. Desiring to make me a maidservant at your lotus feet, you uttered the syllables of your mantra into my ears, erasing all my suffering. You purified me by repeatedly engaging me in hearing, chanting and remembering your holy names and attributes. You even taught me how to serve you by bestowing on me the association of your devotees. Despite all this kindness, I am such a lowly fool that I have not served you for even a single day. And yet, though I am so wicked that I deserve only punishment, you have given me the sweetness of your darshan to drink.”

8.10

The devotee continues, “But when I hear that best of masters say to me with his own tongue, ‘I have become your debtor,’ I become bewildered and wonder what I should do. I have not committed just one or two offenses, but hundreds and millions of them—so many that I consider it pure arrogance to even beg forgiveness.

“I think I must have committed trillions of offenses, all of them longstanding and serious. Even so, leave aside discussion of these terrible, longstanding offenses, whether I have suffered their consequences already or whether I am to suffer for them in the future. What troubles me now is my foolish and offensive behavior of just the other day when I drew poetic parallels between your limbs and a fresh raincloud, blue lotus or sapphire, or when I compared your face to the full moon and your feet to the fresh leaves of spring. It was like comparing a golden mountain to half a sesame seed, a chintamani gem to a chickpea, a lion to a jackal, or Garuda to a fly. By thinking I was capable of praising you, my Lord, I gave proof of my ignorance, and even so I brazenly announced to the world that I had written poetry in your glorification. Now that I have seen your divine form with my own eyes, though it was for but a fraction of a second, I understand that my cow-like poems shall never be able to chew up the wish-yielding vine of your divine beauty with their tooth-like metaphors.”

After making all these declarations, the Lord shows his great satisfaction with his devotee by again giving him darshan of Vrindavan and his pastimes there, all in accordance with the devotee's particular loving relationship. Krishna shows him the desire tree under which is the great Yogapitha, where sits the foremost of all of his beloved mistresses, the daughter of Vrishabhanu, along with her dear companions like Lalita Devi and her handmaids like Rupa Manjari. Krishna then shows the devotee his friends like Subala, the cows he takes to pasture, the Yamuna, Govardhan, the Bhandira tree, Nandishwar Hill, his parents, brother, family, friends and household servants, and all the rest of the residents of Vraja. Revealing all these imbued with excellent rasa, the Lord plunges his devotee in an enchanting tidal wave of bliss until he is stupefied, and then disappears again with his entire entourage.

8.11

It takes a few moments for the devotee to regain consciousness and open his eyes, anxious to again see his Lord. When he fails to find him, he drenches his body with the tears that freely fall from his eyes. “Was it then nothing more than a dream?” he asks himself. “But no, how could it have been just a dream?” he says, answering his own doubt a moment later. “My limbs are not sluggish from bed, nor are my eyes filled with drowsiness. Could it then have been the magic spell of some sorceror? Impossible! Would I feel this kind of joy from a sorcerer’s spell? Could it then have been some confusing malfunction of my mind? No, because none of the signs of mental disorder, like catatonia or mania are present. Was it then just some product of my desires that manifested externally? I don’t think that is possible either, for what I have just seen is beyond anyone's power to imagine. Was it then Krishna giving me a hallucinatory vision of himself? No, that too is impossible, for I have had these hallucinatory visions of Krishna before, and this is entirely different.”

Speculating in various ways on what he has just experienced, the devotee falls to the dust-covered ground in the hope that once again he will be able to see Krishna. When that sight does not come again, he feels distressed and rolls on the ground, crying and bruising himself until he faints again. When he comes back to consciousness, he gets up or sits back down; one moment he runs about, shouting like a madman, the next he sits down again, composed and sage. One moment he ignores all his regular duties like a complete irresponsible, or begins spouting all kinds of nonsense like a person possessed.

When a friend comes to ask him confidentially what the trouble is, he tells him everything he has experienced. Suddenly seeming completely normal, he listens as his confidante tells him, “My dear, most fortunate companion! You have had a direct meeting with the Lord himself!” he is momentarily pleased, even joyful. But then, dismayed, he begins to ask, “Then why does it not happen again?”

After a moment, he reflects, “Ah! I must have had Krishna’s darshan as a result of the mercy of some highly realized great devotee. Or perhaps it came about as the result of something that I did that inadvertently bore some resemblence to devotional service. Or perhaps it on some day, I was truly sincere for a moment, and this is the result of that flickering moment of sincerity. Or perhaps, the causeless nature of the Lord’s compassion has taken form and visited me, who am a tiny ocean of defects.

“But whatever the cause, I had that priceless treasure in my hands out of some incomprehensible good fortune. But now, through some offense I lost it, and I am losing my mind trying to ascertain what that offense was! Where can I go to become free of such obstacles? Is there anything I can do? Where can I find the solution? Who can I ask? It seems to me the entire universe is empty, without a soul, without refuge, engulfed in flames that are about to swallow me as well. I need to get away from everyone and meditate somewhere by myself for some time.”

Once he is alone, the devotee prays, “O Lord! The streams of nectar that flow from your beautiful lotus-face intoxicate all of Vrindavan and fill it with your fragrance! The bees are greedy for the honey that trickles from the garland of forest flowers that hangs from your neck and buzz restlessly all about it. I would see you but one more time. Were I able to relish you for just another moment, I promise to never ask you again.”

In this way the devotee laments, rolls around, breathes out deeply, faints, or falls into a frenzy when he sees the Lord in all directions. Sometimes he laughs, as if he embraces the Lord, sometimes he dances, sometimes he sings, sometimes he can again not see the Lord, so he laments and weeps. In this way he spends his days performing extraordinary activities without any cognizance of whether he is still in his body or not.

In due course of time, when it comes time to leave his body, he is not even aware of its passing, for he thinks, “I invited my Lord, and now he, who is an ocean of mercy, became manifest to me. Now he is taking me to his own abode to engage me in his direct service.” In this consciousness, he is fully blessed.


There were hundreds of problems with the various previous translations here. I would like to analyze them. If anyone has one of the other editions and has a question about the above passage when comparing them, I can give an explanation.
Jagat - Mon, 25 Oct 2004 22:02:33 +0530
Oh yeah, I did want to comment on that little passage about initiation, which does not come out in any of the translations. Clearly, for Vishwanath, the whispering of the mantra into the disciple's ear is a pivotal event:

kAruNyodyota-drava-ceto-navanIto’khila-lokAtIto bhagavan zrI-guru-rUpa-dhArI mad-anAdy-avidyA-vidAri-sva-darzanena sudarzanenaiva tan nirbhidya, tad-daMSTrA-taTAd evonmocya, nija-caraNa-kamala-yugala-dAsI-cikIrSayA sva-mantra-varNa-vIthIM mat-karNa-vIthIM pravezya, nirvyathIkRtya, muhur muhur api sva-guNa-nAma-zravaNa-kIrtana-smaraNAdibhir mAM yad azUzudhan nija-bhaktair api saGgamitaiH sva-sevAm apy abUbudhat

This made your butter-like heart melt, so even though you are beyond the mundane world, you assumed the form of Sri Guru and cut through my timeless ignorance with the Sudarshan disc of your darshan, thus releasing me from those crocodiles’ jaws. Desiring to make me a maidservant at your lotus feet, you uttered the syllables of your mantra into my ears, erasing all my suffering. You purified me by repeatedly engaging me in hearing, chanting and remembering your holy names and attributes. You even taught me the ways of service by bestowing on me the association of your devotees.

This passage could be considered Vishwanath's summary of Guru Tattva.
Advitiya - Tue, 26 Oct 2004 23:59:03 +0530
As I was going through the translation of section 8.4, this particular sentence drew my attention:

QUOTE
tathA sudhA-kiraNasyAtimadhuratve svAda-lolupatve ca,


It was translated as follows:

Sarvabhavana: or like a gourmet, who after many days of sickness and being fed medicines and a bland frugal diet becomes well and is given a feast.

Dinabandhu: A person plagued by hundreds of mortal diseases and burning with thirst by chance drinks exquisitely sweet nectar.

Advaita Dasji: or a person who is afflicted by hundreds of ailments and who is very greedy for taste feels when he suddenly gets sweet nectar to drink.

I really don’t know why they imposed this meaning which is not there or could it be from a commentary?

I would rather translate as Jagadanandaji has translated or I would rather rephrase it by saying “It is like the anxious greed for tasting the divine ambrosia or nectar due to it’s extreme sweetness”.

I don’t think the word “contrasted with” is really necessary there.
Jagat - Sat, 30 Oct 2004 01:56:44 +0530
I have been meditating on the last section of the MK, 8.13. Here is my translation:

This then is the summary of what has gone before: Material ego has two aspects: “I” (one’s sense of self) and “mine” (one’s sense of relationship). The destruction of these two aspects of ego through spiritual knowledge is called liberation. Their absorption in body, the family and possessions is called bondage. When one thinks, “I belong to the Lord, I am his servant. The Lord with his associates, his form and qualities, is an ocean of transcendental sweetness. He is the worshipable object of my service,” in other words, when one identifies one’s self (ahaM) as an associate of the Lord and considers his only relation to be with the Lord (mama), this is called prema. Prema is thus quite different from both bondage and liberation, and has been given the title, “the crown jewel of all human pursuits.”

The course of prema's development is as follows: When one’s sense of “I” and “mine” are still fully absorbed in mundane affairs, this is called samsara. When by some good fortune one gets a drop of faith and starts to think, “Let me become a Vaishnava and serve the Lord,” this brings a whiff of spirituality to one's sense of “I” and “mine” and makes one eligible for devotion. Through associating with saints, this trace of spirituality becomes more substantial, but the absorption of ego in mundane affairs still remains ubroken. When the devotee commences his unstable engagement in bhajan, the ego is partially absorbed in spiritual matters, while its absorption in the mundane remains maximal. When one becomes fixed in bhajan, ego’s involvement with devotional life becomes more pervasive, even while mundane involvements remain dominant. The balance is tipped when one comes to the stage of ruch, at which time the ego is more absorbed in spirituality, though its involvement in the mundane remains pervasive. When asakti arises, the ego’s absorption in spiritual matters becomes dominant and its mundane involvements restricted to a mere trace. With the coming of bhava, the ego is fully absorbed in spiritual identity and a sense of relationship to Krishna. These two aspects of the ego have so reduced their identification with the world that they are reduced to a mere shadow, like a dream just dreamt. When prema is born, self-identification and possessiveness are so completely identified with the spiritual realm that they have entirely lost any contact with the mundane.

By the same token, when bhajan kriya commences, one’s meditation on the Lord is momentary and mixed with other topics. When nishtha comes to being, the mind is only affected by a shadow of other topics. When ruchi awakens, the devotee’s meditation is devoid of ulterior subjects and lasts for long periods. In the stage of asakti this meditation is very deep indeed. In bhava, the Lord appears in visions from the moment one begins to meditate, while in prema these visions become more detailed and one has a true encounter with the Lord (sAkSAd darzana].


This is an excellent insight, and has helped me to understand a great deal. First of all, though it is not pointed out here, it can be shown that the distinction between bhava and prema is that in bhava the aham part of ego has become completely identified with one's spiritual identity. This is why it is called rati, which is also related to the sthayi bhavas. In other words, when one is fixed in one's spiritual identity, that is called bhava. Prema is about mamatA (ananya-mamatA viSNau). At this point self-consciousness is dropped and the relationship becomes everything.

There is a kind of constant dialectic between aham and mama even in all the higher stages of prema.

The point is this: the jiva is a conscious entity, and this consciousness is of necessity egocentric, because consciousness without a sense of self is a paradox. However, as Vishwanath says, the two aspects of ego have to be completely transformed into spirit through identifying as servant of God, and then through becoming absorbed in him totally.

Self-interest cannot be not abandoned, it can only be directed:

na te viduH svArtha-gatiM hi viSNuM
durAzayA ye bahir-artha-mAninaH |
andhA yathAndhair upanIyamAnAs
te’pIza-tantryAm uru-dAmni baddhAH ||

The do not know that their real self-interest is Vishnu, and obsessed with evil intentions, they give all their attention to externals. They are like blind being led by other blind persons, pulled by a thick rope of bondage created by the Lord.(7.5.31)


Jagat - Thu, 25 Nov 2004 05:27:47 +0530
This probably isn't the right thread. I mentioned this somewhere, but I could not trace the original reference. This is taken from Ananta Das's commentary to MK 1.13.

Krishna’s appearance as Vamana Deva or Upendra is described in the eighth canto of the Bhagavatam. Krishna is the fully independent Personality of Godhead, yet he appeared as Indra’s younger brother to serve his interests. When he begged three paces of land from Bali Maharaja, he measured the entire surface of the earth with his first step, all the higher planets with his second, and then with his third step, he sent Bali to the lower realms of Patalaloka. Having thus recuperated the heavenly realms from Bali, Vamana turned them over to his older brother. In this way, he always showed respect to Indra and protected him. Nevertheless, the wise understand that Vamana’s giving respect to Indra and maintaining him was nothing other than a demonstration of his mercy. This reveals his true greatness, and not real subordination. For, just as an individual jiva realizes his full potential by elevating himself towards greatness through sadhana, Krishna realizes his fullness as the Supreme Person through diminishing himself by descending the ladder of mercy.

By the way, the current translation of that last sentence goes like this:

This shows his superiority, not his inferiority. The more the conditioned soul elevates himself through his sadhana, and thus unfolds his full capacity, the more the Lord mercifully steps down or accepts a humble position, making his quality of being the Supreme Lord unfold.
Jagat - Mon, 20 Dec 2004 20:01:11 +0530
A bit off topic, but this is the definition of prema in the Ujjvala-nilamani. Here, of course, this is more about the relation between Radha and Krishna than that of a devotee with Krishna. But, nevertheless, I think that there are important things in this for the devotee to understand.

This is in connection with the idea of liberation. What is liberation for the devotee but this unbreakable bond with Krishna, that despite all the challenges to faith, coming from everywhere--including from God himself, it seems--we persist and find that the seed of prema thrives in our desert-like hearts.

That is Mahaprabhu's mercy, the mercy of the Holy Name, the mercy of the Vaishnavas. But once it is there, it is resistant, even to aparadha. May my creeper of devotion flourish. Everyone, please be merciful to me, for I am not worthy.

sarvathA dhvaMsa-rahitaM
saty api dhvaMsa-kAraNe |
yad-bhAva-bandhanaM yUnoH
sa premA parikIrtitaH ||

“Prema is defined as that emotional bond between lovers
that cannot be destroyed despite all good reason for such destruction.”


loka-dvayAt svajanataH parataH svato vA
prANa-priyAd api sumeru-samA yadi syuH |
klezAs tad apy atibalI sahasA vijitya
premaiva tAn harir ibhAn iva puSTim eti ||


As a strong lion defeats many elephants
and then becomes further nourished
and strengthened by feeding on them,
so too does sacred love, when exceedingly great,
conquer all obstacles before it,
whether they come from this world or the next,
from enemies or from family members,
from one’s own body or the things connected to it,
or even from that dearest one
who is the object of the love itself.

Even if such obstacles should be as vast
as the immeasurable Mount Meru,
sacred love will conquer them and,
having conquered,
become stronger and more vital.

(Prema-samputika, 54.)
Satyabhama - Mon, 20 Dec 2004 21:45:27 +0530
If You do not come,
armed with Your sarnga bow
before these tender shoots of sin
sprouting up from the dense soil of bad deeds
dizzily yielding their fruit
then even You, O Lord of Elephant Hill (Varadaraja)
will fail to cut them down!

Before angry Yama,
with his gaping mouth and terrible knitted brows,
sets his eyes on me
let fall, O Bhagavan, Your glances
dripping mercy, sweet
as the newly blown lotus bud.

----

If You are pleased with me
and I am near You,
O Lord of Elephant Hill-
if I posess unbroken devotion to You
and if Your servants are gathered together-
then this wheel of births and deaths,
O Lord, is my salvation!


----

Those few blessed lovers,
their thin, small bodies swelling in wave after wave
of ecstasy, hair standing on end,
their budlike eyes welling with thick tears
O Varada,
are ornaments in Your assembly.
Their hearts made firm by and inner humility,
they sweeten Your feet.

Those few blessed, O Varada,
see Your dark blue body
stripped of ornaments and silver armor-
the original model for Elephant Hill,
its blue made deeper blue
by fragrant kasturi.

O Varada, bearing on Your throat the marks
of Indiraa's gold bracelets
left by Her tight embraces,
You rise at dawn from Your serpent bed-
may You always be present in my mind's inner core!

Each day, O Lord of Elephant Hill,
may I enjoy, with a thousand unblinking eyes,
Your dazzling body of light,
Your matchless splendor
more radiant with each successive form
riding on the Horse, on Garuda,
the chariot and the royal palanquin.

----

Endlessly enjoying Your beauty
untouched by thought,
O Lord of Elephant Hill, Varadaraja,
I swear I have no desire at all
for Vaikuntha!


----
(a verse on Dayaa Devi, whose form is the body of
Varadaraja
)

Inscrutable Goddess, Mother of the worlds.
Her shining dark body made a deeper black
by Lakshmi's dark glances,
loving companions of Pleasure and Wealth,
and by garlands of fresh young tulasi-
She sheds Her loveliness
over Elephant Hill,
doubling its deep emerald lustre:
may She ever reside deep in our hearts!

---------

(phala sruti)

Those who accept this lofty hymn
sweet to the ear
composed by Venkatanaatha out of devotion
will pluck with their bare hands
every last fruit from the parijata tree
at the summit of Elephant Hill!
Satyabhama - Mon, 20 Dec 2004 21:46:39 +0530
That was Swamy Desika- now Nammalvar

What are we before the gods,
The eight Vasus,
The eleven Rudras,
And the twelve suns
Who worship Him?
To think of reaching Him indeed,
What a sin!
Do you realize, my good heart,
How over-weening our greed is?


(Periya Tiruvantati)

----------------

O clouds, bright with lightning,
Starting towards the high strong-based peak
Of Venkatam lit with gems and gold,
Will you carry my message to Him?
"No" they say. Will they do it
If I pray to them
And ask them to place their feet
On my bowed head?

(27 Tiruviruttam 31.)

------------------

O Lord of the discus
That destroyed the asuras,
It is a wonder to me
How I got this human state:
Who knows how long
I did penance for it?
Having got it,
Through being Thy slave
I thought I could reach Thee.
But that is not to be,
And the long, long time of waiting
Does not die.


(22 Tiruviruttam 90.)
Satyabhama - Mon, 20 Dec 2004 22:03:23 +0530
QUOTE
Here, of course, this is more about the relation between Radha and Krishna than that of a devotee with Krishna.


depends