Re-imagining Gaudiya Vaishnavism - Split from "Lalita Prasad"

In defense of offense--

I have of late been using the expression "reimagining Chaitanya Vaishnavism" (on these forums? maybe not.)

Someone might protest: We are not supposed to "imagine" Vaishnavism, but take it "as it is." To put it briefly, it is not so. We are all living in a world of the imagination, and the Vaishnava world of loving devotion, of sympathetic loving communities, a world of beauty where every word is a song, where every step is a dance and where the trees fulfill our every wish, is very much a world of the imagination.

I tend to think that unless we try to actuate that vision in this world, in other words, unless we can prove the power of our imagination by making it reality, the mere thinking of it is inadequate.

But, Mahaprabhu and the Goswamis showed the extent to which imagination on its own had the power to produce change. So let's start our job there: Let us imagine ourselves first of all as ideal servants of Chaitanya Mahaprabhu, and then imagine ourselves in the midst of a community of like-minded, loving seekers of perfection.

And if what we see around us is wrong, let's try to imagine a better way.

I agree with Jagat. We need to re-imagine Gaudiya Vaishnavism for the 21st century wherever we may be. Remember, those who came before spoke and wrote and lived within the dictates of their time and place. We need to do so within ours. Teachings need to be adapted. Rather than quarrelling over details, let's find common ground and advance our cause rather than beating each other to death like the Yadavas. Let's believe that those who came before did the best they could under the then circumstances and we need not hold them up to some kind of detailed scrutiny except to learn from their experiences and realize that we need to do our best also to meet today's demands. What we do today is more important than what happened in the past.

I agree with Satyabhama. And I did want say something along those lines. Maybe I already did in the previous post. "Imagination" never exists in a vacuum.

We get this impression from those who are imbued with the Nietzschian spirit or some humanistic idealism, that they have found their prophetic message ex nihilo. But all of us are coming in the great human parampara, and as the Bible says, "There is nothing new under the sun."

Even the newest ideas are in many ways the reshaping of ancient ones. That's why the words of the Gita, Old Testament, Plato or the Upanishads can still resonate wity us so many thousands of years after they were spoken.

So the core of our imagination is our self-identity: We are eternal servants of Gauranga (I say Gauranga rather than just Krishna because Gauranga includes Radha), and we are imagining his prema-dharma. Through him primarily we seek that love, but we may go wherever necessary to find nourishment for it, just like Madhavendra Puri was ready to walk the length and breadth of India to find the sandalwood for the service of his Gopalji.

Guru and Gauranga are the sun around which we revolve, and anything that we learn, earn, win or woo, revolves around them with us. And just as we are transformed by the light Guru and Gauranga shine on us, so does their light transforms those things.

I would like to share some thoughts I just copied from the United Church of Christ (UCC) web page. This is the Christian denomination I am ordained in. Perhaps it can give us some guidance as we seek a common ground. How specific or how open do we need to be? The UCC is non-credal, non-dogmatic, non-hierarchical and decentralized. Yet it has a structure and unity. It is not perfect by any means or I would still be active with them. It was however open enough to know my background, accept it respectfully and never ask me to renounce my Vaishnava beliefs or even question them.


How could we use these statements as a model to come up with a common statement that could be generally agreed upon? Do we need a North American (and perhaps a European) Kheturi to sit down and sort things out?

This is the Call to Worship for The Gathering, my interfaith worship, this Sunday. Again, I feel it may be instructive in helping us come together on common ground.

Spirit of the Living God, fall afresh on us. As we gather in this place, allow your spirit to fill our very being.
As we worship today, we remember our brothers and sisters who are worshipping elsewhere throughout the world. Inspire each of us to work more faithfully for justice and dignity of life everywhere.
Raise our vision above the barriers of color, culture and creed that separate us. Give us wisdom as we deal with one another; help us to recognize and to respect different ways, rather than to judge.
In the spirit of Jesus who came not to be served but to serve, we now must walk in the world, we now must reach out our hands with help and open our hearts in love. Awake in us the desire to seek your way of serving you in the world.
Come, people of God, rejoice!
Come, let us worship together. Flames of the Spirit

While I tend to view organized religion as the root of all evil, I also know that without some organization or connectedness or supportive relationships, it is very difficult to do much of anything. How can we do it and get it "right" this time?

Here is a wording we may think about and see how it works for us. Please feel free to edit and rework it.

Gaudiya Discussions is the union of several different Gaudiya traditions: from the beginning of our history, we were a forum that affirmed the ideal that Vaishnavas did not always have to agree to live together in communion. Our motto—"that they may all be one and different"—is our prayer for the unity and difference of the satsanga. Gaudiya Discussions is one of the most diverse vaishnava forums on the internet.

Gaudiya Discussions embraces a theological heritage that affirms the shastras as the authoritative witness to the Word of God, the writings of the six goswamis, and the teachings of the various parivars. Gaudiya Discussions has roots in the "covenantal" tradition—meaning there is no centralized authority or hierarchy that can impose any doctrine or form of worship on its members. Sri Chaitanya is the head of the forum. We seek a balance between freedom of conscience and accountability to the disciplic succession. Gaudiya Discussions therefore receives the historic teachings of our ancestors as testimonies, but not tests of the faith.

Gaudiya Discussions acknowledges as its head, Sri Chaitanya, divine incarnation of Radha Krishna and yuga avatar. It acknowledges as kindred in Chaitanya all who share in this vision. It looks to the Word of God in the Scriptures, and to the presence and power of the Paramatma, to prosper its creative and redemptive work in the world. It claims as its own the faith of the historic parivars expressed in the ancient shastras and reclaimed in the basic insights of the followers of Chaitanya. It affirms the responsibility of the vaishnavas in each generation to make this faith its own in reality of worship, in honesty of thought and expression, and in purity of heart before God.

We, Gaudiya vaishnavas, look toward the twenty-first Century with anticipation. We trust God's promises. We are eager to respond to God's call. We believe that God does have more truth and light yet to break forth from God's holy word.

This thread has been split off from the Lalita Prasad-thread to give it proper space and to keep the other on topic.

Very Interesting and beautiful stuff here! I will keep attending this thread.