Vedic and Tantric tradition - Their influences on Gaudiya thought

Does anyone know why Mahaprabhu and the Goswamis chose to align themselves with the Vedic tradition as opposed to the Tantrik, since their method of worship seems to have alot in common with Tantrik doctrine?

Would you define the two? Are they opposed to each other?

That which follows in the wake of the 4 Vedas is "vedic" and that which follows in the wake of the Tantras is "tantrik".

The common understanding is that they are two very distinct schools of thought.

So the Gaudiya Tradition is a tantrik tradition. There a lot of tantras mentioned in the goswamis writings: Naradapancaratra, Gautamiya Tantra, Brihad-Gautamiya Tantra etc. There was a thread to discuss this, but I couldn't find the link.

See: http://www.vnn.org/editorials/ET9901/ET05-2795.html

PS: betel nut, why you didn't answer to my questions in PM?

Comments on VNN article by Tripurari Swamiji EDITORIAL, Jan 5 (VNN) by Keshava

“The pancaratra and tantra literature represent the feminine half of sacred literature, laying stress on sakti over saktiman.”

This is incorrect. It is a common misconception that Tantra deals with mostly Sakti. Actually the words Tantra and Agama are synonymous. Pancaratra and Vaikhanasa are the two Vaisnava Agamas. They deal with four basic subjects: Jnana, Kriya, Carya, and Yoga. Which in this context mean knowledge of God, the souls and this universe and their rlationship, activities of making deities and temples, deity worship, and mystic meditation. In addition to the Vaisnava Agamas or Tantras there are also separate Agamas or Tantras dealing with Sakti, Siva, Buddha, and Jina.

“The tantric literature of Hinduism is two sided, left and right. The left side (vamchara) deals with licentious rites, and sexual debaucery. The right side (dakshinachara) deals with rituals of purification and strict spiritual discipline in service to the primal sakti.”

The Vaisnava Agamas do not have a left side. It is only the Sakti Agamas that do. Even these so-called “licentious rites” or Vamachara sadhanas like the Panca makaras are not aimed at sense gratification but at spiritual realization by their practitioners.

“Some people do not accept the Pancaratra texts, but Ramanuja wrote Agama-pramanya to establish that the pancaratra has a Vedic basis. Vedanta Desika, the great acarya of the Ramanuja sampradaya, is generally credited with having won the acceptance of these scriptures into orthodox brahmana circles.”

Some people here means Sankaracharya and his followers. Sankara specifically denounces Pancaratra in his Sariraka Bhasya on the Vedanta Sutra. This was later refuted by Ramanuja in his Sri Bhasya. However before even this it was Yamunacharya NOT Ramanuja who wrote Agama Pramanyam, proving the validity of the Pancaratra texts. Later Vedanta Desika wrote another work Pancaratra Raksha which also backs up this position.

Keshava

The Pancharatric tradition is pretty much synonymous with the Tantric tradition. I am not all that certain how common an understanding it is that divides the two apart. Perhaps you could refer to some sources for that common understanding, preferably sources that try to establish that view based on something.

Dear Betal,

I tried to send this to you as a private message but somehow could not.

Casteism and Sexism are there in many societies. Especially the ancient ones. There are many factors. Probably many volumes can written examining these issues.

However I am a true believer in status according to qualification only. Not by birth, not by gender, or color or race. Manu seems to have been very hard on woman as well as sudras. However there is evidence that in Vedic times women were freer and had more opportunity, even rising to the status of Rsis (ie Gargi).

We also trade some of the old problems of discrimination with new problems in our modern culture.

Everyone had a role to play in the ancient Varnasrama society. It is not possible to turn back the clock even if we wanted to and fully adopt the standards and attitudes of those days. So sometimes we have to take what we read in the sastra with a grain of salt. When it is written with reference to another time, place and social system.

Many of the ancient rules were meant simply to deal with the natural differences between men and women. As were some caste rules meant to give more responsibility to the higher castes and more freedom from rigid moral codes to the lower castes.

My travels in India have shown me that women in general still do not have equality with men. (However this is not the only place in the world where this is the case and niether is it the most pronounced) More so in North where the Moslem influence was more. And of all the Vaisnava sects that I have encountered the Sri Vaisnavas seem to have the best attitude towards women. Perhaps due to Laksmi Herself being the Adi Guru of their sampradaya.

Just some thoughts.

As to the question why the Vedic tradition has prevailed. It is perhaps because it is a constant because it is unchanging. Even though the philosophical and practical application of it seems to to change. Actually I don't think that you can make a case that the Vedic tradtion has prevailed over the Tantric. Practically all Hinduism practiced today is Tantric in nature.

Keshava