questioning talasiga - questions to and about talasiga

Oh, all right then.

And just what is the parity between me and Peter?

I am not suicidal and have never taken psychedelics.

The three of us were
talking by the curb
when the garbage truck drove by.

*****

Finding a friend
lost and missed so long
reminds us of those not found.

I just did the Belief-O-Matic test and this is my result:-

Talasiga ji,

In your opinion, is it possible to entirely separate the emotional from the intellectual, particularly in the context of spiritual endeavour? Till what point should one be able to relate to another whose belief system (otherwise non-disruptive) militates strongly against some long cherished spiritual goal.

I know what is written in the "books", but I am curious for an answer from an enigmatic but clearly experienced personality like yourself.

Regards,
Kishalaya

I apologize if you found the question uncomfortable. However my mind usually hovers around tricky issues!

I am asked why I do not consider myself a Gaudiya or aspiring Gaudiya.
Here are some reasons which may seem to some of you as misguided.
I would be pleased to receive any comments in the interests of my dialectical growth.


REASON 1:-
I cannot see the need, nor have I the desire, to classify Chitra Sakhi as Shakti.

Seems a trivial consideration on which to hinge one's acceptance or rejection of anything. Clearly a veiled criticism of those who do proclaim to be Gaudiya Vaishnavas--but a shallow one, indeed.

One who says, "I am a Gaudiya" is one who aspires to the following:

sarvottama sadainya vinaya nirahaM suzAnti nilaya
nitAi graha grasta hRdaya sadaya vizva jIve
tomAra icchAya cale bale tomAra icchAya seve
tomAra gaNa sange se pAya prema rasArNava
tomAra sRSTa hRSTa iSTa gauDIya vaiSNava

kaivalyake narka mAne svargake khapuSpa jAne
indriya kRSNa sevane vizva-pUrNa sukhe
daivatAdi nAhi gaNe tomAra kRponmukhe
tomAra-i audArya vIrya AtmA akaitava
tomAra kRpA mUrtimanta gauDIya vaiSNava

saMsAre se anAsakta bAhya dehe sAdhaka bhakta
antare se anurakta rAgAnugA lobhe
gaurotsave vrajera bhAve sadA iSTa seve
keza-zeSa-sudurlabha gopIra anubhava
acintya prabhAvI se gauDIya vaiSNava

Edited 19 Aug 2004 with

And yet, if there was not a river to be crossed,
no boat, no ferryman, no Radha on the other side,
no Gauranga and his gang of merry men
and manjaris, who made this dream concrete,
would you be making these solar speculations?
That's my point--you've sold your elephant, my friend,
and now you quibble, calling it a pachyderm.
Being you is not as great as being Gaura Das.

Perhaps we talk of diff'rent things.
I too say, "Don't think, feel!"
But your brain-twisting Gaudiya
Is made of straw, not real.

Gora says prema prayojan
And is that not your goal?
Then why you won't accept the name
and make the circle whole?

A weary fight it is, my friend,
to show strength--we are weak.
And to admit that we belong
Won't make us less unique.

And with this thought I will agree,
but say just this, that such as he
has Gaura's name, but not his soul:
He's kicked the ball, but missed the goal.

But from that farce you judge the game?
Excuse me but your logic's lame.

But, of course, it does matter what Radha is. I can understand not wanting to get caught up in arcane battles of the angels on pins variety. But Radha is important. She is what Gaura gives, and she is what gives Gaura meaning. She is the soul of Gaudiya Vaishnavism, so it is true that we have to have some idea of what she is.

But like I said, it's definitely an emotional thing. No one is going to change your experience, and if your experience of Gaudiya Vaishnavas is that they are pompous fundamentalists throwing scripture darts at each other, or engaging in other mundane pastimes, then there is little I can do to change that, except pray that the Gaudiya Vaishnavas of this world really get Gaura's mercy and pass it on...

Talasiga,

Just curious and this is off track, I apologize...

but this is "Questions about Talasiga" so I thought it would be ok..

but I was wondering..

I know you left iskcon many many years ago...did you afterwards ever met any other Gaudiya Vaishnavas outside iskcon/GM in India?

And did you ever make it to Braja and the Holy places in Braja like Radha Kunda or Govardhana?

bangli

Edited 19 Aug 2004 with

Perhaps you're right, we Gaudiyas
put too much stress on identity.
We like concrete ideas and forms
and dislike vague poetic fantasy.
We like our gods with bones and flesh
flesh of lila, siddhanta bones,
not too many metaphoric undertones
threat'ning to turn them into ghosts.

Of course, my Krishna is a metaphor,
but that's just one frame--he is much more.
More than amorphous sat or chit,
He's anand, and that means solid.

Please all of you forgive my offences and allow me to serve the Vaishnavas and keep the name of Radha on my tongue...

I can be a real wiseass I know..

bangli

Maybe metaphor is the blood that streams
through the lila's veins, the stuff of dreams.

pibata bhAgavataM rasam Alayam
muhur aho rasikA bhuvi bhAvukAH

Thank you, Talasiga, for your appreciation expressed in this unusual way. For my part, I look forward to many more inspiring texts from you.

bangli asking me this in another topic

I humbly bow to your feet talasiga and beg u to forgive for any offense I have made to you...
please I know secretly you are special to Radha Krishna and playing a game with us all here..

Please just ask them to consider forgiving such an offensive person as me..

Radhe Radhe,

bangli

So you don't chant "om namah sivaya"? Or you don't play the tabla? Or you don't call out to Chitra Sakhi? As I recall, you denied the identity, not the spelling. I left it in because of the pun, but it stands as "nor will", but now it seems the problem is the spelling. At any rate, I am not in favor of "outing" personal information without the approval of the individual in question, unless there is good reason for doing so. So I have changed it. My apologies.

Thank you for the clarification. Image adjusted.

The moderation & feedback subforum is also available for those who are not full members. You can post there. This topic does not belong under Q & A.

Thank you very much for your kindness. Also, thank you for not patronising me. I really mean that.

Also, when will my membership status be adjusted to show that I am no longer in the "Full Member" group? I want to be seen to be in the same group as Anand.

Best Wishes.

There you go.

Welcome Talasiga.

LOCKED OUT

Squiggly margins, how vain.
Defective poetry, what absurd complaint.

Actually, in this vein,
I like for you to tuck in your tail,
Its sticking out of the /otherwise/
Perfectly aligned return lane.

Customer service is expedient.
Quantities almost unlimited.
Values always generic,
Taste? To see the connection I fail.

However, quality being somewhat bent,
In moderation we spend.

saraswata.net is always appreciative of criticisms of Gaudiya Discussions. They will be very happy to hear about emperors with no clothes and what-not.

With regards "taste". Madhurya Kadambini discusses taste (ruchi) in the fifth chapter. Vishwanath talks about vastv-apekSiNI ruci and vastv-anapekSiNI ruci. One who is more advanced obviously does not care for the externals in devotional activities--if the quality of a singer or Bhagavata speaker is poor, he does not care so much, but feels ecstasy immediately. This is because he is approaching Asakti, where the attachment is not so much to the devotional activity, but to the object of devotion.

But for the lesser devotees, who form the great majority, the externals matter. And indeed, from the point of view of the devotee, they mean a great deal. Care in details of one's service is surely an important matter. If one is a singer, he should sing well, using and developing his talents for the pleasure of the Divine Couple. Similarly, one speaking on the Bhagavatam should work at improving his service to make it professional, so to speak, so that even those who are not already predisposed to hearing Krishna's glories find pleasure and inspiration in hearing them.

We hope that participants here will have a similar attitude towards their posting and dress them nicely. We ourselves try to be essence seekers and take the best of what everyone has to offer. That is why we feel that for a simple suggestion to take on this complexity is entirely out of proportion. And, in fact, out of sympathy with the purpose of this site.

You want taste? This is not the way to get it. So spend in moderation. I am spending too much time in moderation.

Boy,
What is up with Talasiga these days? He cannot let go of all this tug-of-war for some damm reason, and I am getting a little bothered by it all. At first it was Jnani like mental wrestling fun with Tala, now it's become overboard!
Tala..what the hell is wrong? Let this tit for tat go man, just let it go!
Madhava and Jagat are way cool, you should stop and re-consider and stop gettin off on being a Kamakasi Aussie!
Please stay and just chill for a bit!

Peace to you my brother,

Pratap Bangli
(accept no imitation)

We have our ideals. Thank God there are people like you who hold us to account. We continue to hold those ideals, however poorly we may realize them. Our apologies to all for our imperfections.

As to the best, perhaps we do not recognize them. However, as far as we are concerned, the best will continue to shine forth despite obstacles. We are not there to place obstacles in the way of the "best," but if we do so accidentally, we trust in the noble Vaishnavas that they will be magnanimous and look to our intentions rather than to our failures; and that rather than trying to disrupt our efforts will try to help us in realizing what is most noble in ourselves.

In that view, we bow down to all the Vaishnavas and ask for their forgiveness and mercy.

Om Shanti.

There is no shelter in shanti. Your ideal is catching up on you.

Om Shanti means, "That's it. I have nothing more to say."

tala baba:
The Oracle suggests not to doubt your intuition.

bangli mahesh yogi:

Oh .. Confounded Oracle,

Were the Jnana-like tactics you used here only a Trojan Horse, that allowed you a means to convey something more occult ?

Good Morning Confounded Oracle,

Ah Good Morning Bangli Ji. Do you have any questions for me today?
Do you do daily kirtan? Do you have any questions about raagas ?
Did you know that every raaga is a pure devotee? A lot of them are Gopis.

Chitra Sakhi ki Jay!

Talasiga,

No questions for you today, sorry not interested in playing with you anymore...

Kalkiji you have posted this in response to my comment abour raagas and Gopis. As Jagat said a translation would be good. Also, could you also source it please.

Thank You.