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Kali Yuga Or Just Mars? -

Mina - Wed, 17 Dec 2003 05:17:09 +0530
People have been calling attention to the quarreling on Vaishnava forums on the internet, but I have been observing people in general over the past year or two getting irritable and feisty. Maybe it is the influence of Mars, that has made a close pass to the earth. Who knows? Something is up.

I was going to start a topic about avoiding gossip, but perhaps that can go here. At some point the discussion of others goes beyond protocol and degenerates into needless back biting. Whether the gossip is behind closed doors in private or out on some public forums on the internet, it is frivolous just the same. It does not matter whether one is a follower of Caitanya or not, it is a virtue to be cultivated to rise above such discussions.

Let's try to wipe the slate clean with this new URL for the forums. It is up to us to make these discussions exemplary in tone and content.
adiyen - Wed, 17 Dec 2003 06:25:27 +0530
I agree, and what's more, to show my appreciation, I'm on my way to your place to spend Christmas. To set up my trailer-home on your front lawn, along with my 15 kids (with kids of their own), three wives and assorted animals...My surround-sound system (they make them for trailers now) which I think sounds best at full volume during Brahma-muhurta -I am a Vaishnava after all!

Why can't we all just get along? Is it so hard? Peace, man. No more bad vibes!

adiyen - Sat, 20 Dec 2003 10:27:36 +0530
Seriously though, Ramdasji, I think what we are dealing with is the history of the internet, which began for many of us about 5 years ago.

In the first euphoric rush, every shade of devotee opinion hit the net, seeing it as a new opportunity to preach and attract new followers. The naive didn't see that it was also a new opportunity to communicate with previously obscure or suppressed views, and that it would eventually undermine the confidence of some, who had built their faith on what would come to be seen as shaky foundations when all the extra evidence available from suppressed sources accumulated.

So I think there has been a 5 year cycle of dialectic/debate (as well as repeated shorter cycles within that period): first naive optimistic euphoria, then unforseen challenges met with strong rebuttal (eg. the 'antiparty' thing on VNN) but failure by the 'in-group' to conclusively win their debate, which is when they get desperate, 'Well you're all just sahajiyas anyway...' The last move is denial, suddenly asserting in mid debate that the other party is hung-up about it, 'bait and switch'. There weren't just two sides, debates have gone in many directions. What is new is being able to consult opinions, texts and witness accounts which were previously difficult to access.

It has taken several years for these things to work through their cycles, 2 years ago was perhaps when some parties started to get really desperate, hence the 'influence of Mars'.

The result for me at least is enlightenment: for decades I have felt that I was groping in the dark in trying to understand Gaudiyaism, especially Raganuga. It just didn't add up. Parts of the puzzle were missing.

The sun rose for me when I read your very first GV website 4-5 years ago, with the early writings of Nitai, 'Aha! That's it!'. All credit to you both.

Even so, I needed corroboration, a second opinion from a different perspective. Sri Madhavananda Das arrived on the scene with his stunning Together you have solved the problems which have plagued me half a lifetime.
vamsidas - Mon, 22 Dec 2003 02:49:56 +0530
QUOTE(Mina @ Dec 16 2003, 06:47 PM)
Maybe it is the influence of Mars, that has made a close pass to the earth.  Who knows?  Something is up.


Please pardon my astrological ignorance, but I am much more inclined to expect such generalizations from Western astrologers. Am I mistaken? Although I am appallingly ignorant of Vedic astrology, I know enough (I think) to know that different planets affect individuals in enough widely differing ways that there are very few "broad generalizations" that really stand up to close scrutiny.

For some, "the influence of Mars" will bring success; for others it will bring failure. For some, their attempts at vira-rasa will be stymied thanks to Mars' influence, while for others Mars will facilitate conquests in all spheres of life.

Maybe it would be interesting to start a separate thread about astrology, and how (or if) it plays a role in the life of a raganuga-bhakta? I know that when I had my chart done several years ago, I was stunned by its accuracy. Fortunately, I appear to have what people seem to consider a "good chart" overall (though its suggestion that I'm likely a lifelong celibate is definitely a "mixed blessing" in the eyes of some), but I do wonder to what extent a bhakta can expect to overcome/contradict the expectations laid out by his chart.
Mina - Mon, 22 Dec 2003 07:27:30 +0530
I was being facetious. The point was not even remotely about astrology.