Thanksgiving with the Guru - Who would have thought...

Dandavats. All glories to the Vaisnavas.

I just wanted to wish everyone a happy holiday and let you know that I truly appreciate everyone on this boards association. I am off to spend the day with my Guru for a Thanksgiving dinner... I never thought I would be saying that but stranger things have happened.

Aspiring to be a servant of the Vaisnavas,
Rasaraja dasa

Just Curious: Would you tell your Guru you are associating with devotees in the Raganuga web forums? What does he have to say about it?

Dandavats. All glories to the Vaisnavas.

I have never spoken with him about my involvement with this particular forum simply because we haven’t really spoken about anything relating to such a subject. A few months back we spoke specifically about the different devotees that I was associating with which included devotees outside of the Bhaktisiddhanta line and he just asked me questions about my interests. He knows me quite well as we have spent a lot of time together over the last ten years and I believe he knows my interests are genuine and not a reaction to ISKCON or himself.

He expects that if I have questions or come to conclusions that I discuss them with him but that is about it. Initially I was a bit worried that he may be upset with me and I spent time preparing myself mentally for what he might say. However when we actually sat down and talked his reaction was not what I expected. He simply asked about the background of those I was speaking with and had interest in associating with and encouraged me to keep dialogue open with him and present him with questions that I may come up with or interests so we could also discuss together. I believe if I would have presented my interests as a reactionary motivation then he would have been alarmed but just an interest and attraction he was not.

I would actually like to broaden this discussion a bit which would be better accomplished by beginning a new thread. I would like to discuss the human experience of the guru and disciple relationship especially in regards to the dynamics of what can happen when either the guru or disciple develops in a way that was not foreseen at the beginning of the relationship. I would say that the majority of the time this dynamic is a result of the growth and maturation of the disciple and scripture addresses the results of this change but there is still the human dynamic.

Does anyone think this is an interesting topic?

Aspiring to be a servant of the Vaisnavas,
Rasaraja dasa

In principle it is a very interesting discussion, but it might put some devotees' faith in their Guru to the test, so it's a bit touchy too......

Dandavats. All glories to the Vaisnavas.

I agree that it may be too touchy for a public forum... for myself it hasn't been a difficult experience as the changes have come from both side in some respects and again I think that many times the reasons that prompt changes/interests are sometimes more focused on then the actual changes/interests themselves.

From my experience I also think it can be a by-product of either side forgetting that, at the root, this is a relationship. Philosophy should, in most respects, keep our emotions in line or at least headed in the right direction but we can't forget that they are emotions non the less. I have seen many disciples, that due to the scriptural descriptions of the Guru, just totally overlook the fact that the Guru is a person and has emotions. I have also seen that side from different Guru's.

From an emotional perspective the guru/disciple relationship can be viewed by either side to be like the relationship between a parent to their child. For one to "leave" the other for another parent/child would be painful. That is where scripture must keep those natural emotions in check but it very rarely happens as we tend to interpret, or use scripture, to facilitate our side of the issue. On the flip side I know some devotees who, in taking shelter in another Guru, were upset that the initial Guru didn’t object; "See he didn't care about me because he didn't even object that I am seeking shelter from someone else!". It is an interesting dynamic from a human side.

Again in my particular situation I put a lot of thought into how things would develop between myself and my Guru when we spoke about my desires and interests and it really was nothing like I expected. In some respects I feel like it opened up our relationship even more.

Aspiring to be a servant of the Vaisnavas,
Rasaraja dasa